When female ordination is the topic, you can be pretty sure that the conversation is being centered around men 80% of the time. Okay, I’m being generous. Probably 95%. Instead of discussing the value of allowing women to access and yield the power of God on earth—what that would mean and how that would look for women—I find that I am often deflecting errant arguments about what women holding the priesthood means for men. Most common are questions like, “If women have the priesthood, what would men do?” Probably just about what they were doing before, but shouldn’t we be discussing what women might do if women had the priesthood? I think we are so socially programmed to put men at the center of all things that we can only think regarding gains or losses for men. So let’s just address this and get it out of the way.
If we introduce parity, men will lose power and authority. It’s true. That’s the goal. It is what I want to happen.
Look at it like this:
You and I are sitting down to share a pizza. It has eight slices. You take six and leave me with two. That is not fair. You have more than I have. I want us both to have four slices. It is pretty obvious that we are not having the same experience with this meal if you have six, and I have two. But, and here is the rub, to make it fair, you are going to have to lose two slices. That’s the bottom line. It’s just the reality. For us to share this pizza equally, you have got to be willing to give something up. And I know you’re going to try to give me a list of reasons why you need all six slices, and I only need two. But I am here to tell you that I will still be hungry if you don’t give me two more slices of pizza. I can eat just as much as you can. And frankly, I think you’ll get sick if you eat all six. That is too much pizza. Eating all six slices is not good for you. It is better for both of us if we just have four pieces each.
If women have the priesthood, sometimes women will be called as Bishops instead of men. Sometimes women will be elder’s quorum presidents and high priest group leaders and stake presidents and (brace yourselves) apostles. Maybe sometimes when someone needs a blessing, they will call their visiting teachers instead of their home teachers (and that sounds like a beautiful dream to me). Maybe for every young woman that prepares, blesses, and passes the sacrament, a young man will be sitting with his family instead of doing those things. It is just true that for everything a woman does that a man used to do, that will mean there is a man out there… doing something else. Perhaps he’s picked up a hobby he didn’t use to have time for.
So, yes. I do want men to have less power and authority in the church. And that is because I want women to have more power and authority in the church.
And you should too.
If we could get past this, then we could have a real conversation about what it would mean for women to hold the priesthood. We might have a conversation about how women might be empowered and transformed and what women might learn through exercising that power. Female ordination is a conversation about women. We should be talking about how this might affect women.
If we were talking about a corporation or an earthly government, I could find no argument with your position. I wouldn’t have to, because it’s my position too for those instances. As far as the Gospel goes, I’m stuck with what God has revealed to us so far. Everybody has different jobs and in the world those get filled (hopefully) by those best suited to doing them. In the Gospel, it seems to me that we’re given “jobs” to do to help us grow and progress. I may not want the job I’ve been assigned but, in this case, at least I can trust the Guy handing out the assignments (and I don’t necessarily mean the Bishop).
I’m sensitive to your feelings on this subject, I just can’t agree with you without further revelation given to the Prophet to change things. As soon as that happens, Sister So-and-so, Apostle of God will be just fine with me because it will be just fine with Him.
I hope this comes across with the love I mean for it to. Even if we disagree, please know that I don’t intend any animosity.
“If women have the priesthood, what would men do?”
As a man, I find that offensive. Are we just going to mope and drag our knuckles on the ground.
As someone burned out with having WAY too much to do, I WANT to share. The only time my wife had a calling where she was busier than my calling was when she was the RS president. Now that the kids are all gone it is STILL true. I can imagine in some rest-of-world countries it is even worse than in my US (non-Utah) location. It is limiting the creation of stakes and wards.
I do agree that the conversation is too much on one side (what “bad” thing might happen to men) instead of looking for the positive things that could happen for women and families.
This piece is refreshingly honest. I love that it doesn't present things in the typical "easy to swallow" manner that is gentler to some ears, but not totally honest. Kudos!
Leah, I always really enjoy your spirit and enthusiasm. I really feel for you, but as a woman who no longer goes to church yet still believes strongly in the Book of Mormon and the gospel taught by Joseph Smith, I find it sad that you are seeking power from men who have none, at least not the power of God. What they profess is more like the power held by the pharisees. In the New Testament, Book of Mormon and Doctrine and Covenants there are lists of signs that follow those that believe (for example D&C 88: 65-73). Mormon in Moroni 7:33-38 expounds on what we would be experiencing if we had faith. Throughout the gospel we are taught the main goal of this life is to know God(Heavenly Father and Mother united), and the scriptures are clear on this topic, to know God it to see God.
There is an earthly priesthood or brotherhood of men in the church, but there is also one that is attained by all, men or women, who connect with God and part the veil. Those who do this link with God, and their power, knowledge, etc. comes from God.
Why chase after what the pharisees have when Jesus is ready and waiting (D&C 93:1)?
Would you rather offices like bishop, stake President, etc. no longer require ordination (allowing women) or female priesthood ordination, but still barred from leadership?
Have you heard of a model of female ordination that the Toscano’s brought up in the 90s where couples are ordained and called jointly to positions?
For example a couple would be called as the bishops of the ward. Both preside, both can issue temple recommends, both jointly issue callings, etc. I think this may be better than our current model, where one person holds “authority” over others. If priesthood is jointly held, it might be harder to abuse it.
While the idea speaks to me, the cynic in me thinks that our culture would lead to a situation where men still take the lead in joint callings and women submitting. There’s potential in the idea though.
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Michael,
But that would marginalize single people or people in mixed-faith marriages even more than they are already marginalized.
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Michael,
Half the church is not married, I’m not. And as it is, I’m left out of a lot of things at church that I should not be. While in theory it would be good to share responsibility, I fear that men would still do and take credit (mission presidents and their wives) or push it on their wives and still take credit.
I have been reading a lot of posts in this blog and others. I am very surprised how writers and commenters have such a different feeling about the church than I have. I do not feel that in my little branch that men have more power than women. Or that women have less to say about things in the branch, activities, meetings anywhere, sometimes I even feel the opposite (not at all meaning that it would be bad, on the contrary) e.g. sometimes we have only female speakers i sacrament meeting. I have not experienced church this way at all. And we have a lot of women in the branch who take a lot of responsibility and work a lot, which is very respectful and valuable to the little organisation. I understand that someone can feel this way like you feel, but my first thought was that it is suprising to hear something like this… That you feel so strongly about men having power and dominion somehow over women and that women have less to say. I come from a small city and branch in Finland (not a perfect branch with perfect people in any way) and I feel that women e.g. Branch council can say and do say what they feel about different matters. I am a very young local leader and I appreciate womens points of view, opinions, experience etc to all the matters in the branch or in the district (my calling in the district precidency). We in the presidency often talk about how important sisters are and how they are to be involved in everything and I feel that the sisters are involved a lot in our district. I cant say anything about your local organisation and the people there, but I can share about mine. You sisters are very very important even in the leadership of the church, locally, leadership callings, in councils, as wives to missions presidents. And if I see a priesthood leader or other man in the church to take credit for something his wife does, I will personally bonk them in the head 🙂
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E,
I brought up one criticism. You brought up another (and I’m single too). debo pointed out something related.
It’s just an idea I like; I’m not claiming it’s a panacea.
Another piece of the puzzle – the work to do is not limited. The pizza will expand to fill the eaters. This isn't a competition between men and women. It is a challenge in cooperation. And I don't mean women just being "sweet" and going along with what men instruct. I mean both women and men being leaders, coming to agreement in planning and execution of what needs to be done, respecting the revelation given to each person. If men feel they lose if women are included we have a clear indication of unrighteousness dominion.